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Mr. X and Cooperstown

15
Vote

by user DNL

Does this guy make the Hall of Fame? You be the judge. If you figure out who the player is, please do not share it. I'll provide the info later.

He played in the free agent era, mostly for a small/medium market team, at a position where defense is highly valued. He had three Gold Gloves, all after age 30, and he probably would have had more in a different era.

Even at a position where defense is a premium, he was no slouch with the bat. He had an OPS+ of over 100 for twelve consecutive years, ranging from a low of 104 to a high of 156 over that span. He was widely regarded as his league's best hitting player at that position, winning nine Silver Sluggers. He was a league MVP once.

He made the All-Star Game more than ten times over his career.

However, he never lead the league in any standard category. He never cracked the top 10 in RBI or homers, and fell shy 200 dingers for his career. He also failed to crack the 3,000 hit barrier by a large amount, finishing under 2,400. He did have nearly 400 stolen bases over his career, but never lead the league and was only top 10 five times (and only top five once). While he flirted with a career batting average of .300, he wasn't amongst the league leaders there, either, never cracking the top five and only making the top ten only four times.

He appears to have no character issues that would sway voters negatively.

Do you put him on your ballot? Why or why not?

Update: For those still unaware of Mr. X's identity, you may want to click here.


Date

Mon 05/29/06, 11:38 am EST

Enable Comment Auto-Refresher
Alex HolowczakMVP
788 days ago
Score 2+-
I would, he seems to be good all-round in every area, if not spectacular. He sounds like the type of player that a team could rely on to perform. He made 10+ All-Star games, which is impressive in anyone's book. There are probably Hall of Famers who have less than 10 All-Star games to their credit. Since fans vote for All-Star teams, he must be a fan favourite. So I would vote "yes." I just wonder what the catch is...
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SteaksammichRed-Shirting
788 days ago
Score -1+-
I'd say probably not. He sounds like a very good player, but not a great one. And the Hall is for great players.
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Bball3345Draft Pick
788 days ago
Score 2+-
I agree, the Silver Sluggers and Gold Gloves show he was considered the best at his position. The MVP shows he was considered the best player in the league for at least a season.
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Bball3345Draft Pick
788 days ago
Score -2+-
I agreed with Alex
Permalink | Reply
CoreyisarealboyMajor Leaguer
788 days ago
Score -1+-
Based on his numbers alone, no. But, if it's who I'm thinking, yes because he was considered a very, very good player in this day and age. During his best days, he was the top player on one of the better teams in his league.
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ChachiOSUDraft Pick
788 days ago
Score -1+-
I think he may belong on an All-Decade team, but maybe not Hall worthy. Just because he was an All-Star 10 times doesn't mean he deserves to be in the Hall. Maybe just everyone else wasn't very good at that position or he was a fan favorite who got voted in regardless of the season he was having. Sub .300 BA, sub 200 HR, and under 2,400 hits does not sound like a HOF to me.
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Bball3345Draft Pick
788 days ago
Score -2+-
I don't think you are thinking of the right person because the right person was on a team that made the playoffs twice in his career.
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score -1+-
I know who you're talking about, and it's borderline. Some players have gotten in with less, but I'm going to say "no".
Permalink | Reply
DarrelSoccer Kid
788 days ago
Score 1+-
Mr. X's biggest shortcoming was his inability to stay in the lineup all season. While his hitting statistics seem to fall short for many people, it's important to note that his stats are some of the best all time for his position. Guys at premium defensive positions hardly ever lead the league in RBI. That he made the All-Star team 10 times shows that he was a top 5 player at his position his whole career. 3 gold gloves and 9 silver sluggers also point to this; his MVP is just icing on the cake. MVPs rarely go to players at his position.
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CoreyisarealboyMajor Leaguer
788 days ago
Score -1+-
Bball...don't forget the strike shortened season could've likely made three times, not to mention the times his team missed because there weren't any Wild Cards.
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DarrelSoccer Kid
788 days ago
Score 2+-
Mr. X is one of the top 10 players at his position ever. He's almost certainly better than a player who currently plays the same position and is considered a mortal lock for Cooperstown.
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score -4+-
Not only that, his MVP was bogus... he wasn't even close to being the best player in the league that year; as usual, his team did very well, and the writers needed someone to credit for the success.
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CoreyisarealboyMajor Leaguer
788 days ago
Score -2+-
That's usually who the MVP goes to...it's not always about being the best player, it's about being the most important player to the team, and there's no way the other guys on that team put up those numbers without him.
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score 0+-
Correction: there's no way the other guys on that team put up those superficial numbers (like RBI) without him... The most important numbers are the ones that have nothing to do with your teammates' performances (i.e. OPS, RC/27 Outs, VORP, EqA).
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DarrelSoccer Kid
788 days ago
Score -1+-
Davis, if you like those statistics, perhaps you should look up what they have to say about who the MVP was that seasons. According to VORP, Mr. X indeed deserved his MVP.
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score -1+-
You're correct, but I didn't say VORP alone should have been the basis for the vote. A certain someone else, who finished behind Mr. X by only 3 VORP, had much better rate stats -- EqA in particular. As an aside, how about those two guys (Mr. X and his VORP-trailing friend) as members of the all-personality-disorder team? They'd never lose!
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DarrelSoccer Kid
788 days ago
Score -1+-
Davis, just because a corner outfielder has better hitting statistics than a middle infielder doesn't mean he was a more valuable player. Middle infielders contribute much more with the glove, something that isn't taken into account when you simply look at EqA.
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score -1+-
Okay, now a very simple version of my earlier comment, in which I accidentally gave away the year (yeah, I'm a moron): When he won the MVP, Mr. X only beat out his pal from earlier (call him Mr. Y) by 3 VORP. But you can estimate total player value by adding VORP and Fielding Runs Above Average... Mr. X was -4 FRAA that year, while Mr. Y was +6, so that 10-run fielding differential more than covers the 3-run lead by Mr. X in the batting department.
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Patrickburke1980All-American
788 days ago
Score -14+-
ryne sandberg
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Bball3345Draft Pick
788 days ago
Score -2+-
Actually, according to VORP, he did not deserve his MVP.
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Bball3345Draft Pick
788 days ago
Score -2+-
My bad... yes he did.
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DNLLegend
788 days ago
Score -1+-
Patrick, you're not only guaranteeing yourself a -10, but even worse, you're wrong! Well played!
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score -2+-
No, I think Darrel's correct -- Mr. X was first in his league in VORP (he was sixth in the Majors, though). But when defense is accounted for, his performance lags behind certain others.
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Davis21wylieAll-Star
788 days ago
Score -3+-
Whoops, Bball caught it before I posted...
Permalink | Reply
DNLLegend
788 days ago
Score 0+-
I think Ryne Sandberg makes the discussion more interesting. Sandberg is a clear Hall of Famer, and has similar numbers to Mr. X. Why is Ryno treated better than X?
Permalink | Reply
Bball3345Draft Pick
788 days ago
Score -2+-
They are REALLY similar. Sandberg had a few more Gold Gloves to his name and led the league in HRs once. Like Player X, made the playoffs twice, but never advanced to the World Series.
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DNLLegend
788 days ago
Score -2+-
The only reason X didn't have more Gold Gloves is b/c the competition was so rough. In any other era, assuming the award was in existence, he'd probably have another three.
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Alex HolowczakMVP
787 days ago
Score -2+-
When will you reveal who Mr. X is?
Permalink | Reply
DNLLegend
787 days ago
Score -3+-
Tonight or tomorrow, depending on my internet access.
Permalink | Reply
DarrelSoccer Kid
787 days ago
Score -2+-
I knew who Mr. X was right away. Just look at the list of MVPs if you need help. Which one of them played for a small/medium market team, won exactly 3 gold gloves at a premium defensive position, and hit less than 200 homers for his career?
Permalink | Reply
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This page was last modified 08:55, 31 May 2006. Content is available under the GFDL.

Categories: Opinions | MLB Opinions | National Baseball Hall of Fame Opinions | May 29, 2006 | Opinions by User DNL

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